Bachelor of Information Technology, 2004
Engineering and Information Technology Award
Larry Diamond is the Co-Founder and Global Chief Executive Officer of Zip, a leading global Buy Now, Pay Later (BNPL) company providing fair and seamless solutions that simplify how people pay. Larry and Co-founder, Peter Gray, launched Zip in 2013 with the goal of disrupting the broken credit card model, using technology to create a transparent, fairer and more flexible alternative. Larry has led the company from its beginnings as an Australian fintech, to where it is today – an ASX200 company with over seven million customers globally and a $7 billion valuation.
Before deciding to disrupt the payments industry, Larry had spent 12 years working in retail, technology and investment banking, where he first saw the opportunity to digitise financial services with innovative products that bring customers and merchants together.
His career included two years at Deutsche Bank as a Senior Associate within the Corporate Finance team and three years as an Investment Banking Manager at Macquarie Capital. Today, Zip is a leading global BNPL player with a presence in 12 international markets with over 51,000 global retail partners and more than 7 million active customers globally.
00:01
hi everyone i'm emma from uts startups
00:04
and i'm really excited to welcome you to
00:06
uts startups festival 2021 a month-long
00:10
series of interactive experiences
00:13
live digital events and on-demand
00:15
resources to help you take your next
00:17
step in entrepreneurship uh but i'd like
00:20
to begin by acknowledging the gallagher
00:22
people of the euro nation upon whose
00:25
lands our city campus now stands
00:27
i'd like to pay respects to elders past
00:30
present and emerging acknowledging them
00:32
as the traditional custodians of
00:33
knowledge for this land and of course
00:35
that extends to whatever country you're
00:37
on around australia and the world and if
00:39
you know who that is feel free to pop it
00:41
in the chat
00:42
um so he doesn't really need an intro i
00:45
probably will do it anyway because
00:46
you're all here to see him
00:48
so larry diamond is the co-founder and
00:50
ceo of zip one of australia's most
00:53
successful startup companies uh zips a
00:56
buy now pay later product simplifying
00:58
the way people pay
01:00
launched only in 2013 with his
01:03
co-founder peter gray and it sought to
01:05
disrupt the very broken credit card
01:08
model using technology to create a
01:10
fairer more flexible alternative
01:13
zip now has over 7 million customers
01:15
globally and is valued at 4 billion
01:19
you might not know though larry is a uts
01:21
alumni holding a bachelor of information
01:24
technology and is also the recipient of
01:27
this year's uts alumni award for
01:29
excellence in the faculty of engineering
01:31
and i.t
01:32
uh so he's actually joining us from new
01:34
york at the moment where it's 10 30 at
01:36
night so we are incredibly grateful to
01:38
have him join us today
01:40
welcome larry how are things over there
01:43
yeah thanks thanks so much for uh having
01:45
me um
01:46
it's good you know look thankfully here
01:48
things are things are open so you know
01:50
my heart goes out to everyone back home
01:53
um
01:54
who uh you know where you guys are are
01:57
all and um yeah just uh
01:59
snuck away have to thank my wife for
02:01
giving me a couple of months to uh
02:03
integrate the teams and spend some time
02:05
here so i'm going well we'll live
02:07
vicariously through you
02:09
um but we only have about 25 minutes
02:11
with you so we'll dive right in um our
02:13
uts startups community has sent through
02:15
a bunch of questions and we'll get
02:17
through as many as we can
02:18
but of course we'll start with the early
02:20
days um you know in your study and
02:22
career you
02:24
went through the corporate route with
02:25
pwc
02:26
amex specific brands and then what
02:29
you've referred to as your formative
02:30
years at macquarie bank
02:32
but zip isn't actually your first foray
02:35
into the startup world
02:37
um after the gfc hit you bought a
02:39
t-shirt screen printing business in
02:41
sydney tell us a bit about those really
02:44
early days of entrepreneurship and what
02:46
you learned in that business that you
02:47
could apply to sip
02:50
yeah funny time so we uh
02:53
for one year in one day we were the
02:54
owners of a t-shirt printing factory in
02:57
rosebury um and
03:00
and actually sports while it was like
03:02
embroidery for the rugby and back back
03:05
to school um so i was so i'd never run a
03:08
business i was made redundant from
03:10
deutsche bank and my cousin actually
03:12
said hey
03:13
um we can buy a business and it needs a
03:15
bit of restructuring so i had you know a
03:17
lot of finance experience and um
03:20
basically we took over this business
03:23
which i hadn't really managed people
03:25
before even in investment banking maybe
03:27
one person right
03:28
so um
03:30
it was a great up you know we came in
03:32
one was going into administration the
03:33
other one we bought out of
03:34
administration and so a lot of that
03:36
finance experience allowed me gave me
03:38
the confidence to kind of do that and
03:40
you know there were 25 people the
03:42
printing 30 people at the embroidery we
03:44
had to manage people so i think what
03:46
that taught me um is that businesses
03:49
actually start and begin with with the
03:51
people you have to take care of people
03:52
take them on the journey explain the why
03:54
and
03:55
and i think that really gave me a lot of
03:57
that
03:59
empathy when you are managing change and
04:02
now zip there's change happening every
04:04
single day every single week
04:06
fantastic not quite what i was expecting
04:08
but you know people are
04:10
our most valuable asset really
04:12
um so after that you started developing
04:15
the idea that became zip how did you
04:17
identify that gap or opportunity and
04:20
what enabled you to develop that
04:21
opportunity into something more tangible
04:25
so i was
04:26
i was consulting to a good friend of
04:28
mine greg moshall who is the founder of
04:30
prosper which is one of the one of the
04:32
one of one of the great business lending
04:34
businesses here and while i was doing
04:36
that i saw that he was leveraging
04:37
technology to disrupt the world of
04:39
finance for business and i thought wow
04:41
wouldn't that be awesome if we could do
04:42
it for consumer i'm way more passionate
04:44
about consumer
04:46
and so
04:47
that's really where i got i got excited
04:48
by it i looked around to see if there
04:50
was anything else out there
04:52
there wasn't and i thought all right
04:54
we're kind of
04:55
on to something here and um
04:57
managed managed to find um i pitched
05:00
about 60 investors um to kind of raise
05:02
money and they said to me hey that's
05:04
really cool but you don't know anything
05:06
about credit i thought that's actually a
05:09
good point
05:10
and i and i met my founder but when we
05:12
were starting out i'll never forget um
05:14
because i studied at utsbit we did
05:17
database database design
05:19
um and i actually was looking to find a
05:21
technical co-founder but i couldn't and
05:23
i ended up just hiring an engineer out
05:25
of cba and so all the original database
05:27
design was from my rusty relational
05:30
tables which all the engineers still
05:33
cursed me for today
05:36
and and really look we saw opportunity
05:39
to leverage technology to really get to
05:41
know customers and underwrite them
05:42
really really quickly and um we would
05:44
have been really happy to build a
05:46
you know three million dollar business
05:49
i think that's really relatable because
05:51
you know
05:51
it shows that not every
05:53
successful company started out perfectly
05:56
we all started with some
05:58
little work around a little dodgy thing
06:00
here and there that you just made happen
06:01
and and built upon
06:03
but you mentioned your co-founder you
06:05
had somewhat of a unique um
06:07
way to find your co-founder and afr's
06:11
referred to the both of you as yin and
06:13
yang can you tell us how you actually
06:15
found your co-founder and how you're
06:16
both navigating startup life
06:18
together yeah so i think you know i
06:21
definitely wouldn't be here today had i
06:23
not met the love of my life the second
06:25
love of my life peter gregg uh but look
06:28
i ended up calling um
06:30
i went online looking we you know we
06:32
kind of met online i was looking online
06:33
for uh someone to join the company and i
06:36
found this guy that was that applied for
06:37
the for the credit job didn't know him
06:40
from a bar of soap and i think um what
06:42
you kind of realize over time is that
06:44
it's you know sometimes you can have you
06:46
can actually be the only founder and you
06:48
can have people below you
06:50
sometimes you need complimentary skills
06:53
and i think ultimately you have to be
06:55
really self-aware on what you're good at
06:57
what you're passionate about and equally
06:59
what you're not passionate about or some
07:01
of your weaknesses to create the jigsaw
07:02
and there's many ways to kind of create
07:04
the jigsaw um and uh you know pete was
07:07
10 years older than me
07:09
he'd been in consumer finance and you
07:11
know
07:12
all the serious stuff for about uh 10
07:14
years prior but we had
07:16
really the same values we love people
07:18
and we had we shared passion around
07:20
disrupting um and when he joined you
07:22
know i'll never forget like working out
07:25
is he the right partner you know when
07:27
you kind of start out the first day 12
07:29
30 comes he goes for a run
07:31
i said
07:32
i came home that night i said to my wife
07:34
i think i've partnered with
07:36
someone really like this is a fight for
07:39
survival he's going for a run the next
07:41
day he did the same thing and um and
07:44
then you realize you know
07:46
he needs to run to work things out as
07:48
part of as part of his kind of vibe and
07:50
it's been an incredible partnership and
07:51
i think ultimately because we've each
07:53
had our swim lanes and so together we
07:55
can actually cover um a lot of things
07:57
that you need to to build the business
07:59
but i think the call out is
08:00
find the jigsaw and every jigsaw is
08:03
totally different but you have to have
08:05
common values um ultimately
08:08
that's some great advice i hope
08:09
everyone's taking down some notes at
08:11
home
08:13
um and i guess so zip it is a unicorn
08:16
multiple times over now
08:18
but like every startup you started with
08:20
just one customer your first sale which
08:24
happened to be a 500 bicycle can you
08:26
talk us through how you actually went
08:27
about securing your first customer
08:31
yeah yeah i mean the and the other thing
08:33
is the journey is actually more
08:35
important than the destination there's
08:37
like no point going to the end and
08:38
having that billion dollar company
08:40
because it's actually what you learn
08:41
along the way that is way more valuable
08:44
and the good thing about founders is you
08:45
actually have to do everything right
08:47
from pitching i'd never been in sales
08:49
before
08:50
but because i was passionate about this
08:52
i actually was brave enough if you like
08:55
to pick up the phone i tried to hit my
08:57
networks
08:58
no retailers were popping out of the
09:00
networks and i think people kindly were
09:02
looking at us going you don't really
09:03
have a product
09:05
and managed to get to um chapelli cycles
09:08
to a friend of mine we pitched the idea
09:11
he liked it and i think when you're kind
09:13
of building startups you can't wait for
09:16
the finished product so you actually
09:17
have to build and fly at the at the
09:19
exact same time so you almost got to
09:21
sell knowing that you can deliver
09:24
and we started zip in june by december
09:27
we had we had brought on shapely and i
09:29
think the first day
09:30
we took the website down okay because we
09:32
were using an agency in
09:35
in in vietnam a guy named fung who was
09:37
awesome who couldn't speak great english
09:40
by the time we started but by the time
09:41
we finished he was he was flawless and
09:43
he became you know one of our greatest
09:45
wordpress developers um and but i think
09:49
just knowing that we were we were going
09:51
to iterate we said to him look we're not
09:53
going to have the perfect solution for
09:54
you day one but we commit to iterating
09:56
learning having that
09:58
you know that fast feedback cycle zip
10:00
back and we'll kind of just trust us to
10:02
kind of get there and i think when you
10:03
have that that that um open sense of
10:06
communication and are willing to go on
10:07
the journey nothing's perfect there's
10:09
always going to be problems and uh and
10:11
then we built from there
10:13
we're getting a little glimpse behind
10:14
the scenes here but can you broaden that
10:17
and paint a picture of what that first
10:19
year it looked like
10:22
yeah i mean um
10:23
so it started out just peter myself
10:26
neither of us had really started
10:28
businesses before
10:30
i came to work in ripped jeans and a
10:32
t-shirt pete came to work in a full suit
10:34
even though there were just two of us
10:36
working out of my brother's um
10:39
groupon office and it was really about
10:42
and we'd only raised 170 grand half of
10:45
it got spent on plugging into the
10:47
bureaus and all these things so we have
10:49
to work out what do we need to do to get
10:51
to the next gate now you can't do too
10:52
much what are the three things we have
10:54
to do
10:55
um set up the company get the licenses
10:57
build a prototype get the get the
11:00
merchant the customer and so every day
11:02
we'd come in and we'd just really narrow
11:04
down what we needed to do because we
11:05
were doing sales we were we were
11:08
building the product licensing customer
11:10
service
11:11
you know pete was taking applications
11:13
seven days a week between 7 a.m and 11
11:16
p.m and you end up doing everything
11:18
right
11:19
it was complete madness we were
11:20
expecting more money from our investors
11:22
to fund the loan book that wasn't
11:25
happening so
11:26
five grand worth of sales would kind of
11:28
go through over the weekend and we'd
11:30
have to drive around in our pickup truck
11:32
looking
11:33
looking for money from fred you know
11:35
fools family and friends any of the 3s
11:38
and um
11:39
and then we managed to get a cto
11:42
one of the founding team adam who was in
11:44
data science and the five of us would
11:46
just we could all do everything and all
11:48
we had all multiple hats and i think it
11:50
was actually a really
11:52
great time to to set up the business and
11:55
find the groove to give us the
11:57
confidence to move to the next gate but
11:59
it's crazy you work in and i think both
12:01
of us had just had our first child
12:03
large you know working from home a bit
12:05
so it's just complete chaos
12:08
but great times two babies at the same
12:11
time
12:12
one being your business one being an
12:13
actual baby that is
12:15
fun
12:16
you've spoken about the next gate you
12:18
know a few times um but
12:20
in those early days beyond the next gate
12:23
how big did you actually think the
12:25
company could become
12:28
you know as as first-time founders i
12:30
think for us we would have been
12:32
incredibly
12:33
um proud
12:35
had we
12:36
had we built a business that got to make
12:38
you know
12:39
10
12:40
10 million dollars like that would have
12:41
been absolutely incredible um
12:44
to build a business
12:46
identify product market fit find
12:48
customers that like the product are
12:49
willing to pay for the product and
12:52
and and kind of get there and what i
12:54
would say is often
12:55
you
12:56
we were quite fortunate that we were
12:58
solving a good problem at the right time
13:00
a lot of factors have a lot of external
13:03
factors often have to be there for you
13:06
as well right to kind of really make the
13:08
thing take off so you know if those
13:10
external factors weren't there for us
13:11
maybe it would only be 10 or 20 million
13:14
dollars but we'd be as passionate and as
13:16
happy about
13:17
about that result often you just need to
13:19
keep going because you don't know when
13:20
you're going to actually get a moment
13:22
that an industry changes or or or the
13:25
tailwinds really propel you forward so
13:27
as long as you're passionate and you can
13:29
keep coming to work and keep pushing
13:31
through you know hopefully it takes care
13:33
of itself
13:34
i might um be a bit cheeky here and ask
13:37
a question that has come through
13:39
if you can share any confessions so are
13:41
there any things about how you developed
13:44
the company or grew it in the early days
13:46
that you might not have shared at the
13:48
time but now in 2021 you can share some
13:51
of those things for others to learn from
13:56
um
13:57
there's lots of stuff i mean
14:00
there are i mean okay a great example is
14:04
that uh
14:06
we um we had a great back end engineer
14:10
um but we didn't have a great front-end
14:12
engineer to do the design the ui or all
14:15
that look and feel
14:16
look and feel and we and we um used uh
14:20
up work or it was um
14:22
prior to that it was called something
14:24
odesk um
14:26
and what we found out and so we
14:28
basically spent some money we got
14:29
screens designed what we didn't realize
14:31
is that
14:32
the person doing that had outsourced it
14:34
someone else had outsourced to someone
14:35
else and none of it actually plugged
14:37
into our our kind of back end so we
14:39
probably spent about
14:41
six months
14:42
just messing about trying to trying to
14:45
get this right um
14:47
the other the the other one so that just
14:48
shows you how like even us starting out
14:51
had just made so many mistakes we could
14:53
we could have got to a prototype way way
14:55
faster the other one i'd say is probably
14:57
when we were raising money we we raised
14:59
170 grand um we were now two years in
15:02
and we were out of money um i said to
15:05
the guys look i'm gonna have to cut
15:07
salaries which i cut for four out of the
15:09
five people and we went for six months
15:12
not not paying anyone or paying half
15:13
half salaries
15:15
and
15:16
we were kind of running we were kind of
15:17
getting to the end people were just at
15:19
their wits and we had two options option
15:22
one was an offer from a
15:25
a finance guy who basically would have
15:27
given us cash but it would have wiped
15:29
out the equity of all the other founding
15:31
team
15:32
well the other option was actually to go
15:33
public which is just that is another
15:35
crazy story
15:37
and we chose the crazier harder path
15:40
because the because people are so
15:42
important i think had we taken that it
15:43
would have been the easier option you
15:45
know probably easier for myself and pete
15:46
but if we would have removed equity from
15:48
you know all of the earlier guys and
15:50
that just wasn't an acceptable outcome
15:53
well thanks for sharing some of the raw
15:55
and real because i think quite often we
15:56
see startup stories and it's just the
15:58
polished end
16:00
product of an overnight success so it's
16:02
nice to hear some of these challenges
16:04
that you're facing early on and
16:05
continuing
16:07
um now on to some things where some of
16:10
our audience might really be able to
16:11
implement in their own startup um there
16:13
are some really heavy hitting by now pay
16:15
later players dominating australian and
16:17
global markets alongside zip
16:20
how did you go about differentiating
16:22
your brand and go to market strategy and
16:24
how has that changed over time
16:28
yeah so
16:29
probably probably a couple of things i
16:31
think you know we we started out with a
16:33
product that was great it was it was
16:34
good for bigger ticket items
16:37
couches furniture really disrupting the
16:39
old traditional
16:41
interest interest-free
16:43
but we realized that that wasn't going
16:44
to carry us the whole way forward and
16:47
as we were trying to sell that into
16:49
categories like marketplaces and shoes
16:51
where actually the bulk of
16:52
payments volume goes goes through we
16:55
realized we actually had the wrong
16:56
products and so we
16:59
we we we commissioned a few of our guys
17:01
to build a prototype um which was
17:04
wasn't even working at the time we were
17:05
pitching it to merchants and we kind of
17:08
pivoted really quickly to this to this
17:09
new product which actually gave us the
17:11
next um lifeblood
17:14
ultimately what i would say is you have
17:17
to continuously i mean the piece is that
17:19
one is nobody knows anything so you
17:22
you'll get lucky you might get lucky
17:24
with the first product
17:25
but you can't rest on your laurels you
17:26
have to continuously experiment
17:30
i think
17:30
thomas edison said you know genius is 99
17:34
perspiration one percent ins inspiration
17:38
there are no silver bullets you have to
17:40
and the faster you can actually
17:42
experiment get the feedback listen to
17:44
customers
17:46
you need to have the idea first and kind
17:47
of push it the faster you can remain
17:49
relevant and then i think underpinning
17:51
all of that is
17:52
and the earlier you do this i think will
17:54
work better is really identify what is
17:57
your purpose and what is your passion
17:59
and i think if if you can really anchor
18:01
around that that will be the guiding
18:03
light for you for the company product
18:06
design product innovation and give you a
18:07
lens through which to um to build
18:10
product and i think that's how we've
18:11
really differentiated here we've had a
18:12
strong focus on responsibility
18:15
when customers click our button we want
18:17
them to know that we have their back and
18:19
and our purpose is you know creating a
18:21
world where people can live
18:23
fearlessly today knowing they're in
18:25
control of tomorrow and i think you know
18:26
the sooner you can actually embed
18:28
purpose and who you are your identity
18:30
early on even if even it's just two of
18:32
you um i think that will propel you much
18:34
much much farther we knew it we probably
18:37
just didn't speak about it as a language
18:39
in the business as often as we do now
18:42
and as you've sort of gone about um
18:45
experimenting all the time um what have
18:48
been your biggest challenges as you've
18:50
scaled globally
18:54
um scaling globally which i'm doing now
18:57
is um
18:58
yeah it is full on okay because uh first
19:01
of all it's the first time we are doing
19:03
this
19:04
so you know we had a and what we've
19:06
tried to say to zipsters is
19:08
um you know our competitive advantage
19:11
needs to be our resilience to change
19:14
so have really good open dialogue teams
19:16
are going to change we're going to
19:17
reform we're going to change what we
19:18
need to to meet
19:20
the business needs for today going
19:22
global just breaks the brain we're still
19:24
trying to get it right in australia even
19:26
eight years in the right people and the
19:27
right roles the right
19:29
organizational architecture and now
19:31
now you go global so now i've got an
19:34
australian team here us team here and
19:36
i'm trying to work out how does the
19:37
regional how does the functional work um
19:40
and it's pretty hard like and so by
19:43
having good open dialogue setting goals
19:46
putting things in place for you know say
19:48
a quarter
19:49
and
19:50
almost be a self-learning organization
19:52
so we we may get it wrong we may get it
19:55
right okay we feel like it's probably
19:57
right in three months time let's sit
19:59
back let's work out what's working
20:01
what's not working what's missing what's
20:03
possible and let's
20:05
adapt the model and let's um and let's
20:07
do that and so we're continuously doing
20:08
that which is building
20:11
building the plane while we fly and
20:12
continue to drive growth customers and
20:14
all all that good stuff
20:16
so almost operating like an early stage
20:19
startup as you scale but just in a
20:21
different fashion as you go
20:23
and i think what we want to do is we
20:24
actually want to get back to the
20:26
beginning because it's the magic that
20:28
happens when you're small remember
20:29
imagine everyone's working together same
20:32
team same goals decision making is fast
20:35
and how do you do that at scale so what
20:37
we're actually trying to do now is as we
20:39
get bigger make the company even smaller
20:41
so
20:42
build you know autonomous teams which
20:44
are cross-functional that own different
20:45
parts of the customer journey
20:47
they're on microservices so they can
20:49
ship quicker they can make their own
20:51
decisions all under our purpose and kind
20:53
of okrs now that's much harder as you
20:56
get bigger so you've got to be much more
20:57
intentional around how you sort that out
21:00
interesting get smaller as you get
21:01
bigger um on that note though
21:04
yeah fantastic um in the chat i think
21:06
it's uh nicholas asked how did you know
21:08
it was time to tackle overseas markets
21:12
yes so when again when we started you
21:15
know a couple of aussie kids we didn't
21:18
when you go traveling normally go
21:19
traveling overseas to have fun right
21:22
like let's go backpacking around the
21:23
world the greek islands uk we never
21:26
thought we'd actually do business um we
21:29
never we thought it's just
21:31
it's too far away um and so a couple of
21:34
years ago we were we realized that hey
21:37
this thing's actually working um it's we
21:40
are a technology business
21:42
why not give this a crack and
21:44
you know the board said to us
21:47
i don't know if you're going to be able
21:48
to handle it
21:49
things are not working perfectly in
21:52
australia how's customer obsession how's
21:55
the merchant pipeline the technology is
21:56
still being rebuilt so there's just too
21:59
much going on and um
22:01
we said fair fair enough let's just like
22:04
restructure some of the team put some
22:05
people owning it and and and let's go so
22:08
actually two years ago we were just in
22:10
australia we saw this phenomenon and
22:12
that nothing had really happened in in
22:13
the western world but even in the
22:15
emerging markets to leapfrog
22:17
credit cards and traditional products
22:18
and offer awesome credit credit and
22:21
financial products to the population and
22:23
in two years we've gone to 13 markets
22:27
all via zoom really because it's been
22:29
it's been under the under the geyser
22:30
covered and to get there we've had to
22:33
use our warm networks trusted people
22:35
which has actually allowed us to
22:37
accelerate really really fast
22:39
um i'd love to try to squeeze in a
22:41
couple more audience questions as well
22:42
so maybe we'll move to somewhat rapid
22:45
fire
22:46
love this one um from
22:50
josh what made investors trust you
22:55
a good question so when i mentioned when
22:57
we first started i had never i'd also
23:00
never raised capital before okay so i
23:01
had this clunky investment banking
23:03
presentation because i came from the
23:05
investment banking world i wasn't you
23:07
know i wasn't a tech startup guy and
23:09
pitched 60 investors
23:11
and one of them said to me
23:14
look i'm not 100
23:15
confident or sure of what you're doing
23:17
but i really like you and p and i think
23:20
in the formative um years for kind of
23:23
startup reality is
23:25
it's probably 80
23:26
of the individuals and 20 percent the
23:29
idea because many startups
23:31
um might not get there and in and
23:33
generally you might this experimentation
23:35
is iterating this adapting this is
23:37
really how the team for formation is i
23:39
think that was the most sound advice
23:40
it's like he believed in us
23:43
because of our passion and our hunger
23:45
and less about the idea uh he's
23:46
obviously benefited greatly from that so
23:48
i think it's also about finding people
23:51
that really don't just take money for
23:52
the sake of it although that's good find
23:54
people that can get evangelical about
23:57
you and and what you're doing
24:00
so this one is maybe um moving a little
24:02
bit more personal but still relatable to
24:04
all startup founders
24:06
um
24:07
tell us about a time that you might have
24:08
failed or had a perceived you know sense
24:10
of failure and how you've navigated that
24:15
ah look there's been many times along
24:17
the way and in fact you know the
24:19
business breaks as as it gets bigger and
24:21
bigger um
24:23
failures happened uh
24:26
you know missing out on merchants right
24:28
and you know if i remember pitching
24:30
cogan and fantastic furniture in 2013
24:34
the year they joined us
24:36
2017 and 2018. so i think first of all
24:40
don't give up just like incredible
24:42
endurance because ultimately it's those
24:45
that endure that um that that kind of
24:47
make it make it to the end the other
24:49
time was when we were i'd say listed on
24:51
the
24:52
stock market we're just trading sideways
24:55
um
24:55
and uh
24:57
everyone's doesn't believe in us right
24:59
they they think we're not going to win
25:01
um and i think it's again if you're
25:04
truly passionate about what you're doing
25:07
that that also fuels fuels endurance so
25:09
i think make sure that you are really
25:11
passionate about your subject matter and
25:14
um and that it plays to your to your
25:16
strengths um you know don't just go
25:19
chasing the money because it's
25:20
it can be quite quite a long journey
25:22
you're going to go up you're going to go
25:23
down you need to wake up every morning
25:25
feeling super excited about what you're
25:28
up to rather than going and working for
25:30
the uh the evil corporation
25:32
and that requires real passion and fire
25:35
so we've got two more minutes i'll ask
25:37
two more questions one has come from ben
25:40
in the audience linking to what you've
25:42
just said now what would have to happen
25:44
for you to hang up the boots
25:46
that's a good juicy one ben that is a
25:48
good juicing one ben so i'm you know we
25:51
are eight years in all right i had no
25:54
gray hair when i started
25:56
um it doesn't look as great over here
25:59
with with my lovely background so
26:01
it's about
26:03
as long as we can preserve the things
26:05
that we really enjoy so i think if it
26:07
ever gets to a stage where i don't feel
26:09
happy to come to work
26:11
now
26:12
i like to rank every day as a zero a
26:15
minus one a zero or a plus one and i
26:18
think if you're generally in the zero to
26:19
plus one range things are good you're
26:21
going to go through tough times you know
26:22
and there are many moments when over the
26:24
years when
26:26
lots of people resigned for example we
26:28
lost lots of contracts the tech's not
26:30
working you are going to go up and down
26:32
up and down um
26:34
so i think for me it's if i ever come to
26:36
work and it goes for future time and i'm
26:38
just not happy right i don't feel like
26:40
i'm having an impact
26:42
there's um too much
26:44
bureaucracy you know in the evil
26:46
corporation which we won't let happen
26:49
so if i if i lose my passion
26:51
and don't feel like i'm making a
26:52
difference and one of the biggest
26:53
drivers for me is around
26:56
creating a playground at zip for people
26:58
to find their strengths and find their
27:00
passion and almost i believe if we can
27:02
do that we're going to have amazing
27:04
individuals and build an amazing company
27:06
so let's see how we go
27:08
also the other side of that is we are a
27:10
listed company and we have now fiduciary
27:13
obligations to kind of shareholders as
27:14
well so that adds another dynamic to the
27:17
equation
27:19
um so i guess your story and
27:22
success
27:23
is both inspirational and aspirational
27:26
but it can seem out of reach and
27:28
overwhelming for some people
27:29
so what advice do you have wrapping up
27:32
for early stage first-time founders or
27:35
even younger larry on how to take those
27:38
first steps in building a startup
27:42
so
27:43
probably you know i'll answer this in
27:45
two ways you know one is after i started
27:47
tech at university at uts
27:49
loved it um you know it really taught me
27:52
the power of technology
27:54
and i did that for a few years then i
27:56
moved into finance i did that for eight
27:57
years so we had the tech
27:59
we then had the fin and then when i
28:02
started fintech it's only when i look
28:04
back that i went oh wow i actually have
28:06
these two really awesome
28:08
super skills so i think first of all um
28:10
don't feel bad if you don't if you
28:12
haven't identified your strengths yep i
28:15
think you should actually go and
28:16
experiment have different experiences so
28:19
that you as long as it's adding
28:20
something new either something new that
28:22
you like or something that you kind of
28:23
don't like um so if you have to join the
28:25
evil corporation to do that don't feel
28:28
bad um
28:30
at the same time
28:32
on the startup side and starting
28:34
something out i think what is many
28:36
people just don't realize their
28:38
potential
28:39
right
28:40
and i think that's the mindset is the
28:43
growth mindset don't be afraid of what
28:45
other people say
28:48
reflect learn release the shackles and
28:51
everyone has a superpower and a super
28:53
strength and i think
28:55
many of you don't realize what you're
28:57
capable of
28:58
right and i think years ago when we
29:01
started we were scared of raising money
29:03
for investors
29:04
i think the founder is the most
29:06
important person very few people are
29:08
willing to take the risk
29:10
and so
29:11
and it's also you don't need to start
29:13
now if you feel you've got the idea and
29:14
you've got the team great otherwise keep
29:16
going and find a way to get there over
29:18
time
29:19
wow what a perfect way to wrap up thanks
29:22
larry i know i've learned a lot i could
29:24
speak to you for hours about this but
29:25
that was a really awesome 25 minutes and
29:28
uh we're all leaving leaving us wanting
29:30
more i hope everyone dialing in from
29:32
home um learned something as well he
29:35
might not hear your applause but i'm
29:37
sure he'll feel the love so everyone
29:38
please thank me and uh please join me in
29:41
thanking larry for his time and amazing
29:43
advice
29:45
virtual round of applause thank you very
29:47
much emma that was a good chat
29:50
thanks so much